Purpose Even in Pain with Charlene Kuznia
As Charlene Kuznia reached adolescence, she started experiencing debilitating migraines. These headaches, along with severe endometriosis, continued to plague Charlene throughout her years as a wife and mother.
In her 50s, Charlene felt a new kind of pain and tried everything she could to feel better. Nothing helped.
Charlene was diagnosed with a rare blood cancer and began her fight for survival.
She felt “lower than low.”
In a moment alone—face down on her bedroom carpet—Charlene cried out to the Lord.
This week’s “mini retreat in a podcast” explores how Charlene was lifted from her suffering and unexpectedly gifted with a new sense of purpose.
Charlene, along with her beautiful daughter Jenessa, created a new nonprofit called “Down Home.” While undergoing life-saving treatments, Charlene also dedicated herself to helping families transition out of homelessness by providing furniture and décor.
Listen and deepen your understanding of God’s purpose for you!
Learn more about Down Home at www.down-home.org.
Watch Now!
Transcript:
Lindy Wynne (00:00)
Welcome to Mamas in Spirit, a podcast pointing you towards God in everything you are and everything you do. I'm Linde Wynne and it's a blessing to be with you. Hello everyone and welcome to this mini retreat in a podcast and wherever we all each are right now, I just pray that we know that we are deeply tied together as a human family, as sisters and brothers in Christ. And I pray that this time just fills our hearts and souls by the grace of God.
with everything that binds us with one another and together in heaven with him. And I am delighted to introduce you to someone today that was a surprise to me, a glorious little surprise from the Lord in a moment that I really least expected it, Charlene Kujna. Charlene, thank you so much for joining us.
Charlene Kuznia (00:50)
Thank you for having me. Very much appreciated, Lindy
Lindy Wynne (00:52)
Well,
you have a Charlene, you're in the Midwest right now, right?
Charlene Kuznia (00:57)
I'm truly I'm kind of up north in Minnesota, the Midwest, yeah, a little bit in the lakes area, I guess. It would be so halfway down the state a little bit, but in a beautiful area of the state. Yeah.
Lindy Wynne (01:09)
Yes, and I am in Tennessee, but yet Charlene and I met. I mean, I'm just going to lay it out there in a hot tub in Puerto Rico.
Charlene Kuznia (01:13)
Okay.
Who would
thought? Yes.
Lindy Wynne (01:22)
Who would have thunk? That's the God surprise part. So I
know I've shared a little bit on Mamas in Spirit that I was blessed this year to be honored with Tennessee's Mother of the Year by American Mothers. And I went with a precious friend, Rainer, to Puerto Rico for the convention. And I was a little bit nervous about it and I was very excited about it. And the entire thing was so unexpected.
And yet being in territory outside of the United States and a new place and traveling to Puerto Rico without my husband, which was kind of random, but I felt drawn for Rainer and I to go together as sisters in Christ. And then landed in this hot tub the first night where there was only six of us there. And it was me, Rainer, Charlene, her husband, her daughter, Janessa.
who was literally the American Mother of the Year or American Mother's Mother of the Year from the year before of like all the national. Yes, of all the states and her husband. And this is not a Catholic organization by any means, yet a very beautiful, dynamic, generous organization. And there I did have a heart to heart with Charlene the first night we met in Puerto Rico and found out that we share
Charlene Kuznia (02:19)
National. Yes.
like.
Lindy Wynne (02:43)
Mostly first I noticed that we share a heart for the Lord, hearts for the Lord, and then our Catholic faith too. It was just so surprising.
Charlene Kuznia (02:48)
Mm-hmm. Right, correct.
Yeah. Those miracle moments that God just brings to us that we're not expecting. So they're pretty beautiful. Small ones can get to be big ones all the time.
Lindy Wynne (03:00)
Yes, and here we are, still together in this way now.
Charlene Kuznia (03:05)
Yes. Yep, that was back in April of this year and here we are and just in a very good place. Both of us, feel that that time together and that just that little time together was very special. And we became really connected for the rest of the convention, which was and stayed connected now. So it's a blessing, true blessing.
Lindy Wynne (03:27)
Yes, and Charlene is the mother of a beautiful family and her daughter, Janessa, just shines the same light that you do, Charlene. And I just see that beautiful mother-daughter tie. And just in that spirit and the way that the Lord wants us to be profoundly and intimately connected with him and one another, can you please open us in prayer?
Charlene Kuznia (03:35)
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
I truly will. Thank you. Dear Lord, we come before you with hearts full of gratitude. Thank you for the gift of this day, for life, for love, and for the many blessings you have given us. Thank you for your constant presence in our lives, for guiding us through challenges, for strengthening us in times of weakness, and for filling our hearts with peace and hope.
Thank you for Lindy and asking for the Holy Spirit to guide us in today's conversation and for all of our listeners. Lord, help us to never take your blessings for granted. Teach us to live with thankful hearts, to show kindness to others, and to walk in your love and truth each day. In our Lord's name, amen.
Lindy Wynne (04:30)
Amen. In the name of the Father, Son, Holy Spirit. Amen. Charlene, thank you so much for that beautiful prayer. And I love how you said help us to never take our blessings for granted. I was listening to someone the other night share how it totally changes the heart and lifts and transforms the heart to focus on all of God's blessings in our lives. And as we prepare for Thanksgiving when we're recording and releasing this mini retreat in a podcast.
Charlene Kuznia (04:52)
Mm-hmm.
Okay.
Lindy Wynne (04:57)
That's a beautiful reminder. And Charlene, I want to thank you for your yes, because I know this is not something that you normally do. And yeah.
Charlene Kuznia (05:04)
Truly
not. I had a lot of prayers this morning to have the Holy Spirit alongside of me. do. He is the one or Holy Spirit is the one that I really lean on hard whenever I do some speaking, small speaking or any kind. And it's amazing how I feel that he has always come through. I amaze myself sometimes that I some of the words that come out of my mouth.
Lindy Wynne (05:28)
Praise God. love that dependency on God, Charlene, and I have personally witnessed your beautiful, beautiful heart. And so in that spirit, I'd love for you to start at the beginning of your story.
Charlene Kuznia (05:38)
Truly. Okay, so my story began quite a few years ago, if I have to really go. truly, at the time when I was a young girl, going into becoming a woman, I, you to start those monthly things, I also started to receive a lot of migraine headaches. So all through the high school years, all through my
dating years, my discerning years, marriage, working years, children, I would suffer from migraine headaches a lot. That was just something that was part of me. So I would offer that up many times to God. It wasn't easy. There was many times I felt bad for our children. I felt for our family because there was many outings or things that we had planned that would completely
not happen because mom was in bed again for the full day with a migraine headache and they're not fun. And so, but that is who I was. That's where I'm at. And so I felt pain early. By the time I was back in 1986, 87, I was having a lot more female pain So there again, I ended up
with doctoring and I realized I had endometriosis. They diagnosed me. So, which is a painful, I was there too. So between the both, I just thought, wow. With that, I had tried many different medications, did not like that. Taking drugs for that was put me on a different path that I didn't even like myself. And so in 1987, I was only not even 30 years old.
I was without guidance, kind of like going to different doctors, was decided to have a complete hysterectomy, which I thought perfect. I'm finally going to be good, pain free. However, you know, taking your whole body out of whack, just ballooned into a whole bunch of other things along the way as a woman matures and needing estrogen, you know.
and the migraine still happened. so, moving forward all my years, I was working at a bank. I'd been there for quite a few years. It was a good job. My husband and I both were working and our children going to school. So we raised two children, graduated, sent them off to college, and we were in a good place. And by the time we were turning into...
Thinking about getting into the late 50s, we thought, oh, we should start thinking about what our retirement will look like. Just do some plans. All of our children had grown, had married, and had grandchildren in the Fargo-Moorhead area of Minnesota and North Dakota, which was two and a half hours away, which made it harder as they were growing for them to come to visit us. So we'd go that way. So we were doing a lot of traveling and we thought, maybe we just need to be the kind of
parents and grandparents that moved closer to our children, which was what something we did. About this time too, I had been not feeling well in a different way. I knew my body was not, there was something going literally wrong. But I decided I didn't want to go back to doctors and drugs. So I tried to go holistic. And for two years I was going into holistic healings all over. was
I was just open to anything and there was so many different treatments, different things that you pray that this was the answer and nothing, nothing, nothing was happening. And I was only becoming more ill to the point where I had lost a lot of pounds of weight and I just had no energy. I was fatigued. couldn't, I was crying a lot. so finally gave in. said, I need to go.
to see someone that a medical doctor, and this time I changed from just a PA to internal medicine as my primary, which was a good decision. Maybe God was finally saying, hey, wake up girl. And so when I did, was given, was having to do ⁓ much blood work, of course, to get me there. And I found out my gallbladder wasn't working, it was at 17%.
surgery in May of 2017. Get that gallbladder. I got like, all right, this is it. This is going to be good. Okay. And throughout the summer, I did feel better. I had a little bit more energy. wasn't, but I still wasn't right. And I could tell when you know your own body, you really, really do. And with that, then I, my doctor had wanted me to come back to see him. Uh, six months after my surgery for
blood work because he had seen something that he wasn't quite sure if he wanted to check it out. And at that time was coming up my 60th birthday and I was scared because I was in fear. I had no idea because I still wasn't right. And my husband was in fear. Also at that time, a lot of things was happening. We had found a place down near to the to our children and we purchased it that summer thinking that
Well, we'll just use it for weekends until we both are able to retire in about three, four years. so we have a spot, we had a place, we had a home here. ⁓ with that, when I, ⁓ was turning 60 at the end of August, I refused to go before I didn't want to get an answer before. So in September, we're getting a September, I did go and we had quite a bit of blood work that needed to be done. And when I was, went back.
little bit later after all the blood work and my physician told me and I was there myself, it was a blow. I had a very rare blood cancer called an essential thrombocytemia, which is rolls off the tongue better now than it did at that time. I also had hereditary hemochromatosis and I had stage three kidney failure. I was a mess.
At the same time when I was at work, I was dead. was really, I had gotten to the point where I had a buttocks that would not let me sit. hurt. was in pain constantly, so I would either stand. I couldn't sit. I tried a whole bunch of different options to be able to sit on something more comfortable and nothing was working. Plus I felt dead inside. I was really, really dead. I
prayed every day to God. I was just, I would sit at my desk trying to stay awake, trying to function, trying to focus, on my customers. However, I was totally unfulfilled. I was sad. And so when I found out about this diagnosis, I just kind of really fell apart because I was just that low. I was so low. With that,
I decided I had to leave. I'd been there for 40 years. wasn't my plan to be exiting where I worked for all those years and made such good relationships with the customers and friendships. They meant a lot to me. However, I needed to focus on my health. So about that time was the same thing that it worked out that there is a cancer center in Fargo. So I moved to
our new home and my husband stayed back to be able to work because he the insurance. So we were apart for a couple of years and it was very, very hard on both of us. We'd never been apart before. We had done, know, we just thought we were going to be together forever. Right. And so it was hard. I was by myself. I was going through a lot of appointments and at the same time, this was the end of October, my daughter, Janessa and her husband.
Jake and ⁓ the children happened to come up for the weekend just for just to spend the time because after they had found out about my about my news and sitting around the counter in the kitchen as you many families do she had a question to ask me. Janessa had a question she wanted to ask me and she started to talk about how
God had been talking to her and she felt a divine nudge, a divine calling, a divine... because he had been all summer long, she could feel this and she really couldn't deny it anymore or ignore it. And she had asked her husband about this idea which she is elementary school counselor and with that she was in the parochial school system, the Catholic school systems before.
And when children would come to her with issues or problems, she could call the parents and they'd come in and they'd be able to work it out. But in the meantime, but at some point in time, she had moved herself to the public school system in elementary because her children were coming up into the classes that she was going to be teaching and she wanted to be a mom instead of a teacher to them. So she was in the public school system and totally different and it was eye-opening for her.
very huge how different the dynamics of these children were coming to her that had issues. were acting out and they were hungry. They couldn't focus. couldn't, they wouldn't be able to pay attention. They weren't making friends. It just was, and so she would bring a man to her office and try, know, call the parents. Well, lots of times these parents were either living in a homeless shelter
Or if they were in an apartment, they didn't have a way of transportation. So it was a bus. Or if they were working, they'd have to take a bus. They'd have to miss school because they were single parents. So a lot of these children. And it was an awakening. And it was an eye opener of what the awareness of what is really happening in our communities. So with that, this is where that nudge.
was coming into, so God was showing her a lot of things as he was showing me how strong I'm going to have to be with my journey. But when she came to ask if I would want to be part of it, of this nonprofit that she had thought of, she and Jake had kind of put together a name down home, just to where you know them, my name and then
you know, by family. It's a song by Alabama. that's, she grew up on the roots where we were living up north at the farm. So with that, she asked me if I wanted to be part She said, Mom, I will never prayed for you to become sick. And she said, I know I can't do this alone because I can't quit my job. But would you be part of this with me?
if you could be the face of down home and be able to be in the space so that we could, and what we do. And so what down home, what the concept was when we first started was is that you're going to help families that are emerging from homelessness with furniture and decor, which is a great concept. So we were gonna be taking, we prayed to, know, people would start.
seeing our vision and donate some of their gently used items so that we could re-home them to others that we were able to serve. To begin with, so I said, I don't know what it was, it was God. I know what it was at that time too. I just said yes. And truthfully, how she, the carrot that she got for me was that, mom, we get to decorate homes together.
And I've always been creative. I've always loved enjoying painting and being creative. So it was like a light bulb. go like, ⁓ that sounds, this is great. So I said yes right away, you know? It just, but I knew that the yes wasn't coming really totally from me because I was in a, I was saying yes to a different part of it and not saying yes to the whole realm of it.
God was going to show us, but she did. So yes, I did move to where we were at now, near Fargo-Moorhead. And so for two straight years, as I was alone, I would be working at down home. I was going to appointments left and right. I was in phlebotomies. was in, you know, it just was a lot of things going on. So I was kind of a mess too. I really was. was, heavens.
I had down home to help me focus on others as we were helping others emerging from homelessness. With that, it still was hard. I was there myself. I was trying to do a lot and tried to cope with what was going on with me. And it wasn't happening fast enough where I felt like I should get healed better than this. Faster. God, you you got to be here. You got to... Where are you?
Where are you? I had a really bad break at one point in time. It was a weekend that Larry wasn't able to come down to be with me and I wasn't able to go that way. So I was alone and I was down. I was lower than low. And I remember.
Just throwing myself, I fell down on my bedroom floor in tears into the carpet, which wasn't probably very clean. However, face down, I just gave it all to him. I didn't know what else to do. I was there. I was that low.
It was hard. I had to pick myself up somehow because that was just me there.
And yes, he did. He heard. He heard slowly in his time, in his time. And it slowly has gotten to be where I realize that both my both Janessa and I have realized that the journeys we've both been on to get where we're at and how we have done. in the eighth year of down home already. But
how he had been preparing us long, long before even that time of 2017 because he, you know, she was at Elmhurst School Council. I was in finance and baking, so I knew numbers and I liked to decorate. putting our two careers together was truly something we never ever dreamed that we were going to be able to. Totally different in different places. And yet,
God had that plan that years before, decades really, that he knew that what we're doing now by helping others, we're a very faith-filled nonprofit called Down Home. We are now being able, we have served in the eight years intentionally with the full, we've served the whole home, the whole, you know, all three bedrooms or whatever, the sofa, the table.
give them dignity, to give these families emerging from homelessness more than just windows, walls, doors, and a floor to sleep on. Because that's what many of them were doing, sleeping on the floor, eating on a cardboard box turned upside down. They had nothing. And there was no way for these parents, parent, many times it's always been one and a female for the most part, that
They don't have a way of getting buying if they're just they're worried about just paying rent, food, getting the kids to school. They have all that on their head. so who we are is we don't help find their spaces where they're going to be living. That's where the case managers and referral agencies of the homeless shelters that we've that we've made partnerships with. But what we do is fill that little nudge, that little gap or just, you know, that we can
bring dignity, safety, empowerment, integrity, compassion to their space. And we do it very intentionally. When we meet a family, we ask them the likes and dislikes and stuff. And we go back to our warehouse of many, many, many gently used items now, because over the years we've very generous community, very generous that we are able to
kind of really coordinate well to their likes and dislikes and colors to make it theirs. know, right to everything on the walls. We are very intentional with inspirational and with faith-filled. And we do pray for every client that we've ever served. Every Wednesday morning we have power prayer, so all of our volunteers come together and we get to pray together. And it's a really special time on Wednesday mornings.
But we always have, we always begin every meeting with prayer. So I've never been in a such a faith-filled environment, but it has brought me really a lot closer to relationship with God.
So that's kind of like where I'm at. Although right now I just retired. I did. Because at my age, I just feel I'm being called for something different for down home instead of on the staff.
Lindy Wynne (21:43)
Charlene ⁓
Yes, praise God, Charlene. Thank you so much for sharing all of that. And I am just praying to the Lord right now to provide because there's four things in there that I'd really love to talk about and then talk more about your intimacy with the Lord. And the first is that you said that the Lord was molding and shaping really you and Janessa, mother, daughter over many decades. And I think of the Lord as the potter that's in scripture. And I just love that, that idea of God
Charlene Kuznia (21:56)
Anyway.
Lindy Wynne (22:24)
molding and shaping us and that when we surrender our lives and we pray to be in God's will, God, it makes us in a sense like hopefully by God's grace more moldable and more shapeable so that we can do his work and even in a supernatural way because I do believe that some of this is supernatural Charlene because the work that you did and have done when you've been so sick is tremendous. It's deeply, deeply moving. So that mother-daughter dynamic and that's really how I felt
Charlene Kuznia (22:35)
Yes.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
Lindy Wynne (22:52)
It's almost like I got a touch of that, divine touch of that that night in the hot tub was the maternal piece of it because we're here at Mama's in Spirit. And I said to Charlene, before we started, I'm always looking for, and I've always been looking for in my lifetime, that maternal care and that maternal love that is given out so abundantly through, you know, in an abundant number of ways that the Lord does. And so I felt very covered.
Charlene Kuznia (22:57)
Right.
I know.
Lindy Wynne (23:19)
that night by the Lord in the hot tub, having that heartfelt conversation with you and with your husband. so thinking of that, that mother-daughter dynamic duo and how both of us is together and allowing the Lord to mold you and to shape you in his will is very, very beautiful. Okay, the second thing.
Charlene Kuznia (23:33)
and
Lindy Wynne (23:44)
That's really two things. So first is being moldable and shapeable. And the second thing is that mother-daughter dynamic, which is so intimate and so glorious because like you talked about and alluded to is that you and Janessa and all of us, like we all live in the real world with joy, with trials, with suffering and the abundant goodness of the Lord. Like all the things are part of all of our lives.
Charlene Kuznia (24:03)
Mm-hmm.
Lindy Wynne (24:12)
And the intimacy that you and Janessa share is deeply, deeply moving. And I do believe as a reflection of God's blueprint for mother-daughter relationships. So that's the second thing. The third thing, when you talk about being face down in the carpet, and then you also said, which I thought was interesting, it kind of struck me that you don't even know how clean the carpet was. And here you are face down, you know, crying out to the Lord.
Charlene Kuznia (24:19)
Thank you.
I know. Buddy,
how I remember that. Because that's what that, oh my gosh, this carpet's probably really dirty. Silly. I know. I know.
Lindy Wynne (24:40)
Yeah.
It's funny the things that we think of in certain moments in our lives. You know, I think
that is at the heart of the matter because in talking about down home too and the conditions of some of the children and the families, like those are worse than being faced down in your carpet. You know what I mean? So I think there's deep ties actually in all of this. And so to think of you there, and I've brought up this story so many times and I encourage all of us to go read it, the Talitha Kuhn scripture, Little Girl Arise.
Charlene Kuznia (24:52)
Yes.
Yes, yes, yeah, that's a good one. Yeah.
Lindy Wynne (25:12)
when Jesus goes to the little girl who the father thinks has passed and you talk Charlene about feeling dead at work. And that's also an interesting word choice, but yet you were in a sense like dying. I mean, all those months that you didn't feel well, I imagine that the blood cancer, was it liver failure or kidney failure? Liver failure, like all of these things. That's awesome.
Charlene Kuznia (25:31)
liver failure. Oh kidney, I'm sorry, kidney, yes, sorry,
Lindy Wynne (25:37)
Kidney, it's good you forgot. It's good you've moved on. ⁓
Charlene Kuznia (25:38)
Yes, Yeah, no.
Lindy Wynne (25:41)
You've moved on from that, from your kidney failure. Like you were dying and you were feeling dead inside and in all the ways. And yet God met you there face, face down, kind of a culminating moment, the low of lows in the carpet that day. And you are always, we are always each one of us, God's little girls. That doesn't change. It's like we say, like Janessa is still your little girl. It's like,
Charlene Kuznia (25:56)
Mm-hmm.
Lindy Wynne (26:06)
were always the little girls of the Lord, that are Heavenly Father. And God reached down in His time and in His way, because it's different for all of us in each moment, little girl Charlene, my blessed, beloved child, arise and lifted you from that. And the last thing, the fourth thing is the idea of down home. And this is so glorious. Is that Charlene, my goodness, you are like dying in a sense.
Charlene Kuznia (26:06)
Yes, always.
Lindy Wynne (26:32)
But yet you are giving. It's so touching to think of Janessa coming to you at the kitchen counter in a typical moment. You said, like families do, not every family does do that though, Charlene. I mean, I'm sure a lot of us have longed for that in our lives and longed for that. But you sat at the counter and hear your precious child, Janessa. And that's a story for another day to ask Janessa, like the Lord's work in her heart while you are here so sick for her to say, I want you to be the face of downhill. I mean, that's kind of crazy.
Charlene Kuznia (26:59)
That's exactly your words.
Lindy Wynne (27:00)
It's like so beautiful. It's so,
that's God at work and God at work in Janessa's heart with you, her precious mother to say, I want you to be this, you know, here you are mom fighting for your lives, but I'd like you really to fight for the lives of all these other precious little children and families in our community, because what they're suffering with and what they're struggling with is also tremendous and tremendously difficult. Will you do that? And you gave your little F Fiat.
Charlene Kuznia (27:05)
Yes it is.
Lindy Wynne (27:29)
not knowing what you were saying yes to and here you are today. I and I just want to add one thing. When my husband, it was like the second time he was very sick when we were very young in our marriage. And I'll never forget being in the hospital, here he is like being pumped full of liquid, pre-endosone, solu-medrol and starting on pill chemo. And seriously, we're like in our mid-twenties. This is like nuts, right? Second time he's fighting for his life.
Charlene Kuznia (27:55)
Yeah. my goodness, yes.
Lindy Wynne (27:57)
And I'm thinking in my little feminine way that, ⁓ when the doctors leave the room and the nurses leave the room, we're finally going to hold hands and kumbaya and talk about our feelings and connect and all the things. And he's like, can you please give me my computer? Because I need to work. At the time, I think I was a very bad communicator and I'm still growing. I was kind of heartbroken because I was like, I think I really needed a hug and a good cry.
Charlene Kuznia (28:16)
There it goes. Wow.
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Lindy Wynne (28:25)
But instead I got him
his computer, which he needed. And I understand this now, you know, because it's like 25 years later, I'm a little dense. And I recognize the fight to live, the fight to still be in God's will and to fight to live. And I've seen this in other people and a precious girlfriend of mine, which I will encourage her to listen to this because she's been very sick with cancer with little girls and her fight, her fight to live.
Charlene Kuznia (28:29)
Yeah. Yeah.
Lindy Wynne (28:53)
And it's like Charlene, your little f fiat was an fight to live. You felt like you were dying. You felt like death, but you fought to live for the Lord. And there is a time for us all to surrender and go home to the Lord. But instead you were going to down, you were going to down home and I don't mean down home. So Charlene, what is that? What is that?
Charlene Kuznia (29:01)
Yes.
And that's...
I don't know. Sometimes I am marveled
at it myself. I truly am marveled at it myself many times because it's it's miracles, miracles constantly, little ones, big ones. And the more you are living in His grace that you know that He has been there, the more you see every little miracle are big ones. They just get bigger because they are good for you.
God is hearing you always in his time and in his way.
Lindy Wynne (29:40)
Yes, thank you for saying that in his time and in his way because even when you say that again, I am reminded of your suffering because all those years of migraines and then you talked about like feeling bad because you were back in bed and you couldn't do something with your children and I'm sure like my girlfriend I just talked about. Yes, I mean these are real things that happen.
Charlene Kuznia (29:54)
Right? Yes, that was hard.
Guilt. A lot of guilt.
Lindy Wynne (30:00)
How did God work in that and has God continued to work in that? Guilt and shame, those are toughies.
Charlene Kuznia (30:06)
Yeah,
they were hard at those years that when the kids were young, it got to be kind of like quite often, unfortunately. You know, I guess, you know, growing up as a cradle Catholic and getting all my sacraments, everything and right in our little country church there and got married there, my husband was also from the same parish and all of the as a cradle Catholic and all of his sacraments too. So we really both did.
you know, he had God with us. My relationship with God was different. I really was, I felt closer to Jesus. I would pray to Jesus a lot more. kind of put God was always there, you know, but for some reason Jesus and his suffering probably is what I could relate to more. And I would try to offer up that every time I was, you know, because I thought,
I know other people have things worse in life than I do. And so this too, I will be able to overcome, hopefully, prayfully, with prayers and asking for help.
Lindy Wynne (31:08)
Yes, and while I appreciate that you say like other people have it harder, and I think that there's true to that in certain ways and the way that we kind of wrap our minds around our lives and our different conditions that we live in and there's truth to that for sure. And we have our Catholic social teachings for a reason, we have Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs for a reason. At the same time, what binds us
Charlene Kuznia (31:24)
Okay.
Lindy Wynne (31:36)
so deeply are the deepest dynamics in life and that we see in the life of Jesus and that is the suffering that is beyond expression in word and the joy and the love and the goodness like these things we all have it doesn't matter what the exterior of our lives look like
And I almost wonder, and I don't want to plant this, but I'm going to anyway. Charlene, do you think, this is not therapy and this is like therapy 101, don't do this. But anyway, but do you think that your experience like with your migraines all those years and, and not being able to do certain things and being in your bed and all the feels and all the things, do you think that that's somehow
Charlene Kuznia (32:09)
Truly.
Lindy Wynne (32:25)
shaped and molded your heart to be able to say yes to down home and to walk with and accompany and let them accompany you too in kind of the ministerial work that you've done.
Charlene Kuznia (32:40)
Yes, I could say that. mean, while I was at work sitting at my desk, not feeling like I was functioning like I should be, I really felt I didn't have a purpose. I was just doing the motions. I would get up in the morning, get ready and go. And I knew I was going to be just a long day. It felt monotonous. felt...
unfulfilling. I, you it was a day in and day out, kind of like the same humdrum thing, and not feeling well did not help it. It just brought me down even more. With that, I guess, yes, you know, I would pray. I prayed every day as I'm sitting at my desk, bored to
that I needed, I needed, I remember asking God my times, you gotta give me something more, you gotta give me something more of a challenge. I need something that challenges me. I feel like there's just, this is going nowhere. I've been here for 40 years and I just, help me get through two more years so I can retire at 62. Yeah. No, he had different plans. He did hear all those prayers. He did hear it in a different way.
I, um, he had plans for me. And I always say that I was too chicken to quit my job because I was so close, you know, to where are you going to go? You know, at, you know, I have two years to, and so he made me sick. I, you know, I can take him for that, but he did it in a different way. He did it his way. He made me sick that I needed to stop where I was at and completely.
change direction. And, you know, I felt we were going to have to figure it out, my husband and I, you know, to make ends meet or whatever it looks like. And just bought this house besides, you know, and I thought, okay, you know, this is this isn't good timing, you know, but but I was glad I guess part of me was relieved to a degree. had answers finally, after all that time.
to answers to where I do where it was all in my blood. mean, where the cancer is, I have too much platelets. And so with that, I'm on oral chemo daily for my life. So it's treatable, it's not curable. It is kind of cancer that if not treated and not taken care of, turn into leukemia blood. And then the hereditary chemochromatosis is too much iron in my blood.
So that was definitely a down to thing by having too much iron. That's not good for the blood. And that's where it was making me even, you know, between those two, they were fighting against each other and the kidney failure. So, you know, in his way, he did it his way. So yes, he, was fearful. So when all of this happened and I moved, there was a lot of fear.
I did a lot of praying, but you know, there's still fear. I, I really struggled with hope, ⁓ at that time, because I wasn't there yet. ⁓ I was still trying to figure it all out myself. I was going to do all, you know, okay, you got me here now, Lord, I'm going to just go to go. And that, and that time when I, you know, totally gave myself to the floor and my bedroom was when I finally, I said, I can't do this myself.
I'm trying. I'm just trying to do everything that I need to be doing to get myself and I can't and you're just gonna have to take it God because I don't have it. And he did. And he did. Yeah. Yes. Yep.
Lindy Wynne (35:59)
Praise God, praise God. I want to try to
talk just for a minute, Charlene, and then I'm going to ask you if there's anything else that you want to share. And so I want to just plant that seed for you now. So you can listen with your heart. OK. I want to talk about fear, courage, and hope within the context of your story and how it applies, hopefully, to all of us. When you talk about fear and the fear of leaving the known,
Charlene Kuznia (36:11)
Okay.
Lindy Wynne (36:24)
the known of your job, the known of what you've been doing, the known of these humans that you connected with and you really cared about and that you had spent many days of your life with or connecting with over many years in some way. That known and then that dive into the unknown that you were really forced into yet also takes great courage. And you talked about how you think about and you've thought about and you've pondered about suffering and Christ suffering.
And I think about Jesus in the garden, which I know it sounds weird, but it really is one of my favorite scripture passages. And maybe that's because this is at the heart of the matter is that Jesus was in the garden sweating blood. And he said, father, if it is your will, take this cup away from me. But if it's not God's will, Jesus was going to follow. Jesus was going to follow. And Jesus was both divine and human. And so it took great courage, I imagine.
Charlene Kuznia (36:58)
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
Lindy Wynne (37:19)
in my own humanity. I hope that's theologically correct, but I'd be surprised if it wasn't because that's what a yes from us and we're called to follow the sacred blueprint of Christ, the blueprint, capital B blueprint is that yes, our own small f fiat. And so that takes courage. And so for you to leave everything that was known to make that yes and great courage,
and that this was God's divine plan for you in your life, but it also took kind of knowing your mortality because we are mortal. And so tying this back, sometimes I think that even in my own life, and I wonder if everybody listening can relate to this or if this is an invitation for us to relate to this is that when my husband, when I thought I lost him very young,
It was so incredibly difficult, yet there was a sacred message and lesson in this as a 24, 25 year old young woman. And that was, that we're mortal, that I could not bank on my husband living as long as I would have him live or even myself. Like it's a difficult, different thing sometimes just depending on a person's life to face that relatively young in whatever way it comes before us.
Charlene Kuznia (38:18)
Mm-hmm.
Yes, truly.
Lindy Wynne (38:38)
So was really facing your mortality that I think maybe that you'd have to answer that. And I know for myself, and even in our call and our vocations as parents, the way we have become parents through foster care and adoption and all the things, it's like sometimes facing or even just knowing and accepting mortality, it helps us to say yes, because we realize that tension that this life is finite.
Charlene Kuznia (38:52)
Hmm.
Lindy Wynne (39:05)
And it will not last forever as we know it. we were smacked. We're smacked with that in the face. It's right in front of us. And here you were kind of face planted on the carpet facing that you're more mortality. And we don't have time to get into it. I'm so sad you being separate from your husband and the comfort of your precious husband, who I also had the blessing of meeting. It's like, I never would have known y'all had faced all of this when we met that night. So anyways, so there's that.
Charlene Kuznia (39:15)
Little bit?
Mm-hmm. Yeah.
Or it's not.
Lindy Wynne (39:33)
And then hope, this is the last thing I want to talk about. Hope comes from the Lord, it's supernatural, it's a gift, it's a grace. And it sounds to me like when you sat at the counter or when you were face planted, like in all these moments that God enkindled your heart with hope. It wasn't your body, it was your heart and your soul. So that your body would follow suit where embodied souls to live out this mission and this call. And so how beautiful because,
That moment at the counter, that's the rich life. That is the rich life. It's not how much we have or whatnot. It's love and it's those beautiful connections and connections with our loved ones, healthy, loving connections, imperfect, but glorious. so God enkindled your heart with hope when you were face down on your carpet, when you were at the kitchen counter, and I'm sure many, many other times before for your yes. And we are that dependent.
Charlene Kuznia (40:26)
Yes.
Lindy Wynne (40:28)
to lay our lives down, to lay our very beings down to the Lord so the Lord can say, to lethe koum, little girl, arise. Praise God. Anything else, Charlene?
Charlene Kuznia (40:36)
Beautiful.
I don't know. It's just it's been to me. I feel it's such a beautiful story. My life. I mean, we all know we talk about that to to our to our clients and said that, know, they're all they all matter. Everybody's valuable. Everybody is loved. Even if they don't feel it. And then you have a beautiful story to tell. You know, God's not done with you yet. I feel very blessed to have been able to be this part of.
my journey. I'm just kind of closing a little chapter right now, being retiring. So that's how I kind of been looking at it and talking about it. But I'm excited to see where God is going to put me next. That's what I'm really, my biggest thing too that I have found, I will say, and how she just came to me was our mother Mary. She was someone I never really connected with. I didn't have
I didn't feel like I had a relationship with more Jesus than God. But ⁓ for some reason, somehow, some way, Mother Mary has put her, you know, realizing how important she is and how much as a mother, how I could depend on her for the lot of things that I've felt even with, say, family in my journey, in my job, having a spouse.
You know, there's always been, it's, you know, with Janessa and I, we both could say, you know, that, this journey hasn't been, it's not a honky dory, you know, it's been a lot of hard work, a lot of growing, a lot of, we always said if we knew then what we know now, we, don't, I don't know if we would have said yes, but we're not sorry, we both, I mean, it's, we really feel that there's a beautiful thing going that God planted in us. And now that we have new staff.
young ones coming in that are able to share their gifts and watch them blossom and being able to move forward in the down home story now that we're got in the down home family. It's like to me sitting back and just watching them. just I'm just marveled and I thought look look God look look what you're bringing to us. know bringing the perfect people with the perfect hearts and the passion. It's like there there's a lot of beautiful angels out there.
all the volunteers, all of our donors that we've had over the years, all the relationships, good friends. I mean, all of this was opened up to me by taking that step and moving on in a different direction, which I still say I would have been too chicken to have done it on my own. So I just have to always praise God on that one forever.
Lindy Wynne (43:08)
Yes, and that's
what I was thinking. Praise God and praise God for the courage and the hope that you have been blessed with and therefore for your beautiful story and testimony. Thank you so much, Charlene, for sharing.
Charlene Kuznia (43:20)
Thank you for having me, I appreciate it.
Lindy Wynne (43:22)
And where can everybody learn more about Down Home?
Charlene Kuznia (43:25)
Down Home, our website is down-home.org and you'll be able to find all of us there and who our new staff is and what we do. We also have a Facebook page, so same address, down-home.org and like us on Facebook, follow us and you'll be able to see a lot of our before and after transformations and some of the families and.
We're gearing up now for a Christmas party. We always have an annual Christmas party for all of our families that we've served. Like in old time, when we have Christmas cookies, we have songs, we have goodies, we have gifts. So some families that we've served have never had a Christmas. That's when they don't even know what it's like. And so it's growing. Our family is growing. We just served family number 240 something.
I think it's getting close to 250, which is we've, you we think of all the thousands, hundreds, thousands of lives between the donors that see the ripple effect of their donations, whether it be the in-kind donations of the furniture or monetary, the volunteers, the case managers, our staff. It's all a beautiful, beautiful thing that has been given a gift.
to us. I remember the first time he served a family, it was right before Christmas. And the reaction of the mom and her nine-year-old son that had never had a bed in his life brought her to tears, the mom tears, which brought all of us to tears. And truly, as we're sitting around our dining room table for Christmas, was, we talked about that, how the gift of how they, what we did was just our hands and feet.
It was a bigger gift than any other gift we've ever had, we've ever been received. So it's pretty beautiful.
Lindy Wynne (45:11)
Yes, that is beautiful.
Thank you for sharing that. I feel like that's providential timing as we are about to enter into Advent and Christmas seasons. And it reminds me of our son who we adopted at six. Oh my gosh, I will never forget not only his first Christmas, he has intellectual disability. So every Christmas since he's going to be 27 this year, and he celebrates Christmas like it's his first and I'd never seen we'd never seen anything like it.
Charlene Kuznia (45:18)
Thanks.
Okay.
Yes?
Lindy Wynne (45:40)
So in that spirit and the Holy Spirit let us close in prayer. In the name of the Father, Son, Holy Spirit, amen. Dear Lord, I just wanna thank you and praise you for your goodness and your abundance and the way that you provide us with just what we need, the courage, the hope, the healing, the love. And Lord, I pray that we keep our heart on you during this time and as we enter into Advent soon and Thanksgiving is right around the corner and just whenever anyone's listening.
Charlene Kuznia (45:42)
Awesome!
Lindy Wynne (46:07)
to this many retreat in a podcast, Lord. We always need these things from you. We always need them, Lord. So we just pray in our free will to turn our hearts towards you, willing hearts, open hearts for your abundant love. In your name we pray, amen. In the of the Father, Son, Holy Spirit, amen. Thank you everyone for being here. There are many more faithful podcasts at mamasinspirit.com and many more coming before the end of season seven coming soon.
Charlene Kuznia (46:25)
Amen.
Lindy Wynne (46:35)
And it is always a blessing to gather. Can't wait to be together again next time. This is Lindy Wynne with Mamas in Spirit. May God bless you and yours always.